Kekkei Genkai: Advanced Chakra Control, Dark Release ⌠高度チャクラ制・冥遁, Kōdo Chakra-Sei: Meiton⌡

Elements: None.

Specialization: Ninjutsu or Fūinjutsu.

Location: (Scattered) Ronin only.

Clan History: This Bloodline began first as a Hiden, practiced in its imperfect form by a loosely-bound group of people: otherwise non-notable ninja who shared a desire to know more about the secrets of chakra. Their development of various techniques was upset by the Second Shinobi World War, although the heavy and widespread conflict of the Third served as a perfect time for the gang to collect test subjects and further their research into the workings of their new - and forbidden - jutsu. Three months after the Third Shinobi War ended, the stronghold they had managed to keep until then was destroyed by the rubble dislodged in the Tragedy of Yosuga Pass. Nearly a decade passed, and one of their ilk had his Kekkei Genkai stripped from him, though the manifestation was not as potent as a natural user of the style, even if the thief's chakra certainly made his techniques impressive. In the centuries that followed, however, they branched out, staying hidden underground. Few lived to see their techniques and tell the tale, and even those have been lost to history's weave.

Struggling out of the raging sea of time, their blood is fortified. It's filled with hate, with resentment. With longing.

Kekkei Genkai Description: Dark Release is a misnomer, as it is not an advanced nature transformation. Rather, it is pure control over mental and physical energies; as such, putting it in the name and having "KKG" in the Specialization section of a jutsu is enough to distinguish a technique as using Meiton.

This unadulterated form of chakra control is so strong that it can even control the chakra of others, allowing them to perform shape manipulation on chakra that is not theirs; this is demonstrated most clearly in their Divine Possession technique. (They cannot control others' chakra without a jutsu, obviously.) Most often, however, it controls the flow of mental and physical energies belonging to others by directing it into the caster, "stealing" their chakra straight from their bodies.

• Senjutsu has no bearing on Meiton absorption techniques, as their methods absorb chakra, attempting to bypass natural energy; Meiton jutsu that absorb other jutsu, or other Supplementary Meiton techniques that affect jutsu, can ignore Senjutsu's +1 interaction bonus.
  
  
• Dark Release requires users have a mark on their palm, as this is the primary entrance to the secondary chakra pool. Ninjutsu users, however, can make jutsu that absorb directly through the mouth so long as their technique also required hand seals, or has some sort of drawback. Fūinjutsu and Medical users can inscribe a second Body Seal on their other palm as well, at a ninja rank of B or higher.
  
  
• The foremost ability of Meiton is to absorb chakra; this extraneous chakra is stored in a secondary chakra pool, which is only usable by other Dark Release techniques; it is henceforth referred to as Dark Chakra, and the Dark Chakra Pool. Any jutsu type can incorporate the process of Meiton: as a result, any jutsu with a speed, power, and range lower than maximum for the rank or a drawback of some sort (moderator judgement on both), can drain a small amount of the victim's chakra at the same time as it executes its primary aim, as an additional effect listed in the jutsu. This auxiliary effect begins at D-rank jutsu (drains 5) and increases to 10 at B and 15 at S.
  
  
• If chakra absorption is the main effect of a technique, it can drain chakra equal to its own cost +5. Maintainable techniques can drain chakra equal to the maintenance cost +5 per post, or half the maintenance cost per hit (so a -5 maintenance cost would take 2 hits to drain 5 from the victim); drawbacks can increase this number, but not by more than 5 over the normal amount.
  
  
• Dark Chakra is used exclusively as a secondary cost for techniques such as Dark Release: Judgement, and stealing chakra from others does not replenish the caster's normal reserves in any way, or confer any other positive effects (unless specifically stated in a jutsu). Because they stole it from someone else, users of Meiton cannot actually mould the chakra in another way after they have deconstructed it. Thus, they cannot use it for the activation costs of techniques. They can, however, infuse techniques of their own with stolen chakra, essentially "pumping up" an already structured technique by simply giving it more "fuel". By paying Dark Chakra equal to the activation cost -5, the caster can increase one of the attributes of a jutsu (speed, range, power, auxiliary) up to the next rank's equivalent. While multiple attributes can be boosted, one attribute cannot be increased more than once this way. If a jutsu has two of its attributes increased, it interacts with other jutsu as if it was a rank higher. Each jutsu that is able to be 'pumped up' must be applied for as such, with the modified damage/range/speeds/etc. included.
  
  
• Elemental techniques absorbed by Dark Release, or the chakra of someone maintaining an elemental technique, will grant the wielder Elemental Dark Chakra. (The amount of each element's chakra that has been absorbed should be noted.) If the caster 'pumps up' their own jutsu using Elemental Dark Chakra, the technique interacts as if it were that element.
  
  
• Meiton defensive jutsu that grant the caster Dark Chakra can only block 1 technique of equal rank or 2 of 1 rank lower, but they absorb all traces of the absorbed jutsu, reducing collateral damage to zero. Jutsu that do not grant the caster Dark Chakra but still neutralize other jutsu may block 1 technique of 1 rank higher, 1 technique of equal rank, or 2 of 1 rank lower.
  
  
• Being devoid of elements and thus never actually needing to devote time to learning how to use them, those of this clan have extra time to learn new disciplines and further their knowledge of the ones they possess. Myōsome start with three Specializations, and may train their Quaternary to S-rank, for 6000 and 9000 words respectively.
  
  
• A wielder of Dark Release will only fall unconscious from chakra exhaustion when their normal reserves are below 10 and their Dark Chakra is below 20.
  
  
• People of this lineage tend to be rather....eccentric, that word taken as it will be. They can begin with a fourth positive Special Characteristic, but must balance it with two negative SCs instead of one.
  

Drawbacks:

• Centuries of research have led to the current adaptation of Meiton. The extensive biological experimentation has resulted in either an unfortunate mutation or a certain...resistance to further intercession. Myōsome have Pharmacophobic or Hemophilic bodies, and must take one of the associated negative SCs without balancing it with a positive. Strangely, even females from this bloodline can be Hemophiliacs.
  
  
• Due to their constant absorption of others' elements and the myriad chakras passing through their system, over time it warped their own ability to create Nature Transformation. Myōsome do not start with, nor can they ever learn, an element. This does not stop them from using others', it simply means they cannot generate the change in nature by themselves.
  
  
• Myōsome start out not being able to control chakra very well at all, not just that of others. Their secondary and tertiary Specializations start at D-rank, and their primary at C-rank.
  
  
• The Dark Chakra pool cannot be used for the primary cost of casting jutsu.
  
  
• Advanced Releases from other Kekkei Genkai cannot be stolen properly, since those from this clan lack the ability to recompose two natures into one again, or to create a single advanced nature; however, they can steal one of the Advanced Element's base natures if it possesses one.
  
  
• The Dark Chakra pool starts every thread empty, and must be filled manually by absorbing chakra. A Myōsome has the following limits to their Dark chakra pool:
  
  D-rank - 30 chakra
  C-rank - 60 chakra
  B-rank - 90 chakra
  A-rank - 120 chakra
  S-rank - 150 chakra
  SS-rank - 180 chakra
  
  If more chakra is absorbed than one's secondary chakra pool can accommodate, it violently ruptures, causing moderate internal bleeding if it was just over one's limit, or severe hemorrhaging if it was 30 or more chakra over the limit. It will also cause hemorrhaging if the chakra limit was reached all at once (with one absorption) If one's chakra pool ruptures at all, it is rendered useless for the remainder of the thread. Meiton jutsu whose primary purpose is absorption will fail to activate if the secondary chakra pool ruptures.
  
  
• Absorbing Senjutsu into one's chakra pool without having the ability to wield it oneself can end quite badly. Absorbing a Senjutsu technique deals damage to the Myōsome of the technique's rank -2, which is generally constrained to the place where they absorbed it; through the hand seal would deal damage to the arm's muscles, and through the mouth would injure one's organs. Repeated absorption of Senjutsu, however, allows the injury to spread further and further.
  
  
• Due to their inclination to absorb it so easily with their Meiton, Myōsome have less endurance towards Ninjutsu, taking 1 rank higher in damage from opponents' attacks that primarily use Ninjutsu as their offense. (Offensive techniques that use Ninjutsu for support, such as Crescent Moon Dance or a speed boost, do not gain this advantage.)
  

Members: None currently.

Kekkei Genkai Jutsu:

Dark Release - Black Hole:

Dark Release - Judgement:

Dark Release - Dominion:

Dark Release - Gluttony:

Hiya
I am leaving the rule challenging part of this clan to Aya. This means that this clan may still be denied at a later time.

KKG:

"any jutsu with a speed, power, and/or range (any where applicable) lower than maximum for the rank, and/or a drawback of some sort"
Not really sure what you are meaning here, as this line covers basically every jutsu.

I would like you to remove the "any jutsu can use meiton" part and have the jutsu list it as an element like normal. If you want to augment other jutsu with meiton then you can maybe add a jutsu that does that. I don't see why if you shoot a fireball at someone that you are stealing chakra from them without having your kkg listed in the description.

You'll need a big chakra based drawback to offset all the free chakra you'll be getting. Maybe this meiton usage has a maintainable cost or the cost of chakra stealing jutsu is higher.


Jutsu:

Dark Release, Inhaling Maw ⌠冥遁・吸穴孔, Meiton: Kyūketsukō⌡

The strength of this jutsu needs to be taken down

Add in that the spec used needs to be stated when the jutsu is used.

Give methods of use for each spec and a description for each.


Dark Release, Wicked Self-Destruction Extraction ⌠冥遁・邪自滅斗 , Meiton: Jajimento⌡

Multi element jutsu start at B rank

This is an area of effect jutsu and should comply to those range rules.

Remove fuinjutsu from the specs as there is nothing to do with sealing in this jutsu

"can crack a few of the target's bones from their impact with the ground, though widespread heavy superficial bruising is more common."
It is unclear what is happening here, does the jutsu launch the target but only do bruising at impact point?

What is the "Effects boost" list for?


Dark Release, Divine Possession ⌠冥遁・憑神 Meiton: Tsukigami⌡

"only to the extent that they know how it works"
Give more detail here

If there are any other applications other than controlling chakra projectiles then list them.


Dark Release, Genjutsu Dissipation ⌠冥遁・幻術解, Meiton: Genjutsu Kai⌡

Not really sure why you have the genjutsu kai in your clan jutsu or what it has to do with dark release.


Phew, alright that's it for the first round. Make edits and return. I can tell a great deal of effort has gone into this app. Just try not to get to complicated ^^

"any jutsu with a speed, power, and/or range (any where applicable) lower than maximum for the rank, and/or a drawback of some sort"
Not really sure what you are meaning here, as this line covers basically every jutsu.

Clarified, I hope. I meant that by reducing overall normal capabilities of a jutsu, you can add in Meiton's ability to steal chakra as the jutsu's additional effect.

I would like you to remove the "any jutsu can use meiton" part and have the jutsu list it as an element like normal. If you want to augment other jutsu with meiton then you can maybe add a jutsu that does that. I don't see why if you shoot a fireball at someone that you are stealing chakra from them without having your kkg listed in the description.

I had meant for the KKG to be listed as an element in the jutsu, and its chakra-stealing in the description, if this was used in a technique. The extensive description as to what can be drained is just a guideline both for jutsu makers and those modding them.

You'll need a big chakra based drawback to offset all the free chakra you'll be getting. Maybe this meiton usage has a maintainable cost or the cost of chakra stealing jutsu is higher.

You say it's "free chakra", but I can't use it for anything except augmenting jutsu I already pay my own chakra for. It is a secondary resource to power up my own jutsu, but I can't use it to pay chakra costs outright.

Dark Release, Inhaling Maw ⌠冥遁・吸穴孔, Meiton: Kyūketsukō⌡

The strength of this jutsu needs to be taken down

Add in that the spec used needs to be stated when the jutsu is used.

Give methods of use for each spec and a description for each.

Did all you asked for.~

Dark Release, Wicked Self-Destruction Extraction ⌠冥遁・邪自滅斗 , Meiton: Jajimento⌡

Multi element jutsu start at B rank

This is an area of effect jutsu and should comply to those range rules.

Remove fuinjutsu from the specs as there is nothing to do with sealing in this jutsu

"can crack a few of the target's bones from their impact with the ground, though widespread heavy superficial bruising is more common."
It is unclear what is happening here, does the jutsu launch the target but only do bruising at impact point?

What is the "Effects boost" list for?

I see absolutely nothing in the rules that state that multi-element jutsu must be B-rank or higher. I can remove the part where you can mould your own chakra nature with it, but returning a mass of already-elemental chakra should not be as difficult as moulding it yourself. Also, I have stated that the caster can only add one elemental effect per casting of the jutsu.

This jutsu is not a 'radius effect' as I think you are referring to as 'area of effect'. It is a single-direction cone that expands outward as it travels forward. Thus, I will not reduce this technique's range, to those small numbers, but I will reduce the size of the cone's max width from 15 to 10 and the range from 30 to 25.

In the KKG Description, I do say how sealing has to do with this jutsu. It unseals the chakra from the secondary chakra pool.

I clarified, you are correct in your interpretation.~

The "Effects Boost" list is part of the Infinite Evolution part of Dark Release, as stated in my Kekkei Genkai description. Instead of augmenting the speed/power/range of the jutsu, it can also allow the additional effects of the jutsu to be augmented, which in this case varies with the element used.

Dark Release, Divine Possession ⌠冥遁・憑神 Meiton: Tsukigami⌡

"only to the extent that they know how it works"
Give more detail here

If there are any other applications other than controlling chakra projectiles then list them.

Done, and the only other thing it could do is stop the target jutsu's function in its tracks.


This Kai is the clan's adaptation, which allows them to siphon out the chakra used for the Genjutsu, after they dissipate it for normal Academy cost.

KKG:

Ok I think I have a better understanding now. One thing that I should mention is that this system won't be able to do is exceed the boundaries of normal jutsu limitations of their rank. Instead, they can have added effects and be stronger (within the guidelines). In this way, you'd remove the part where you can make the jutsu count as one of a rank higher. This seems fair to me, as it is like you are taking away strength from one jutsu to have it draw dark chakra, and then giving another jutsu strength by adding dark chakra. You can reduce the dark chakra costs to fit this better.


Drawbacks:
will be looked at once we have a cemented kkg


Jutsu:

Inhaling Maw:

I'm.. not happy about the whole keeping the element absorbed part. Not only is it adding another layer of complexity to an already complex system, but you are controlling and shaping that chakra into completely separate jutsu. If you compare it to a fuinjutsu technique, where you can seal a jutsu and then unseal it to fire it back, this is much more complicated as you are absorbing it into your chakra pool, storing it and then moulding it into a different jutsu. Doesn't sound like something that you could do for elements you don't have an affinity for.

It seems like you have two separate jutsu in one. Pick one of the applications.

Wicked Self-Destruction Extraction:

To address the area of affect jutsu range part, your nerf is acceptable as the total area of your jutsu is ~125.8 (if I didn't screw up the calculations), and the area in the guidelines is ~113.1. So for a clan jutsu with extra cost, I think this is acceptable.

I realise that part of the strength of this jutsu was in the elemental part so you can buff other parts of it when you take that bit out.

So the jutsu is launching you and damaging you on impact with the ground.. There isn't really any standard for damage taken from falls and stuff, so give a description as to what part of the jutsu make the target take the damage once he hits the ground (maybe the dark chakra clings to him and increases his weakness to bruising). Note that damage applied in this way would be unreliable, a more effective way would probably just have the damage apply on impact with the wave.

The large spoilers of extra effects that can be added is too much, having either one or two per jutsu is good enough.

Dark Release, Divine Possession:

Add in a sentence that says that the user can't control people directly by using this jutsu.

Dark Release, Genjutsu Dissipation:

I can't give you the whole amount of chakra used for the genjutsu, maybe 5 for D-B and 10 for A-S. (Personally I'd just have the second part of the maw jutsu instead of this) Also specify that the chakra absorbed is dark chakra.

Dark Release, Genjutsu Dissipation:

I can't give you the whole amount of chakra used for the genjutsu, maybe 5 for D-B and 10 for A-S. (Personally I'd just have the second part of the maw jutsu instead of this) Also specify that the chakra absorbed is dark chakra.

Dark Release, Divine Possession:

Add in a sentence that says that the user can't control people directly by using this jutsu.

Done.....

I realise that part of the strength of this jutsu was in the elemental part so you can buff other parts of it when you take that bit out.

So the jutsu is launching you and damaging you on impact with the ground.. There isn't really any standard for damage taken from falls and stuff, so give a description as to what part of the jutsu make the target take the damage once he hits the ground (maybe the dark chakra clings to him and increases his weakness to bruising). Note that damage applied in this way would be unreliable, a more effective way would probably just have the damage apply on impact with the wave.

The large spoilers of extra effects that can be added is too much, having either one or two per jutsu is good enough.

Fixed the bludgeoning damage to be on-contact with the jutsu.

Large spoiler of extra effects....you mean depending on the element that is used, or the Infinite Evolution spoiler?
Elements: I can only use one of them per jutsu, and this jutsu accounts for one's ability to absorb any base chakra nature, that is why it would have to be so large.
Infinite Evolution: I keep this in line with what the KKG says, allowing to increase speed, power, range, or auxiliary effects.

I'm.. not happy about the whole keeping the element absorbed part. Not only is it adding another layer of complexity to an already complex system, but you are controlling and shaping that chakra into completely separate jutsu. If you compare it to a fuinjutsu technique, where you can seal a jutsu and then unseal it to fire it back, this is much more complicated as you are absorbing it into your chakra pool, storing it and then moulding it into a different jutsu. Doesn't sound like something that you could do for elements you don't have an affinity for.

It seems like you have two separate jutsu in one. Pick one of the applications.

You're right, it normally would be difficult to mould chakra that isn't of an affinity you have. Hell, users of Dark Release are even more inept at normal elemental moulding than most. However, that's why they have Meiton. It's superlative shape and form manipulation, to the extent that they can manipulate chakra that doesn't belong to them. Because they can't transform their chakra into other natures very easily, they have to circumvent that step and then mould the chakra into a nature they can use. I can understand where you're coming from in that normal ninja couldn't handle that sort of chakra manipulation. But I'm not aiming to be normal here.

I choose the jutsu absorption.

Ok I think I have a better understanding now. One thing that I should mention is that this system won't be able to do is exceed the boundaries of normal jutsu limitations of their rank. Instead, they can have added effects and be stronger (within the guidelines). In this way, you'd remove the part where you can make the jutsu count as one of a rank higher. This seems fair to me, as it is like you are taking away strength from one jutsu to have it draw dark chakra, and then giving another jutsu strength by adding dark chakra. You can reduce the dark chakra costs to fit this better.

May I ask why can't it go over the rank's capabilities, if I'm paying more chakra to make it stronger? Admittedly the chakra I'm directly paying is not my own, but I must have used at least one jutsu in order to steal it. More chakra is already allowed to be paid as an extra cost to a jutsu in order to make it more effective, as you've acknowledged in your modding of Judgement.

Okay, I trust fukai, but I'm stepping in here for a moment, these things 'will' happen and are non negotiable if you want this clan approved. This is a banned element with a special release, this clan is going to need to be not only good, but PRISTINE simply to get passed.

I want an AT LEAST 1000 word history, mandatory. Covering its use and story in canon and anything else you want to add.

KKG

• You're lowering the numbers for how much you can store. To the lines of 20 at D rank, and you can get another 20 per rank. So, 20, 40, 60, 80, 100 and 120 for SS rank.
  
  
• Any elements of any technique you absorb lose all their properties as jutsu. If you indeed corrupt them with the darkness of negative emotion to the point that it would corrupt nature chakra, then elemental chakra would lose their identity. You're sucking in the chakra as a power-source, it would not retain any properties whils stored in a chakra pool within your body.
  
  
• You are not able to use 'ANY' possession style jutsu that would allow you to control or manipulate another player character directly. Jutsu which facilitate god-modding like shadow possession and the like are strictly not allowed. So, that rules controlling chakra within another person almost completely out, unless you're just doing things like 'drain touch.' But any ability which would force a person to roleplay their character under your control, is strictly a no-go.
  

Disadvantages:

• You need WAY more active disadvantages. #1
  
  
• I want a 'bad' disadvantage for absorbing more than your limit. Something that can potentially be crippling.
  
  
• And that detection clause, I want you to be 'unable' to hide it with stealth techniques.
  

Jutsu

• no elements, you say you remove special properties, elements are a very special property. You're deconstructing the jutsu and corrupting it and turning it into dark chakra, which, as you say, has no elemental affinity, strengths or weaknesses. Also, I'm not allowing you to both have a drain release like this, and also the ability to use chakra natures you don't have. Just no. Because if you don't have katon, you can't mould or control katon chakra. Simple as that.
  
  
• And simply for all jutsu, you are not able to exceed the damages and benefits of jutsu within their rank. Ranges we can talk about, speeds... maybe in extreme cases, damages don't exceed max. Fin. as far as I'm concerned this jutsu is WAY too versitile as it stands to be this powerful, and in its current incarnation, i would like the beginning numbers on 'everything' to drop to almost minimum, then you can use dark chakra to bring them back up. Or, you can focus the jutsu to do a more specific thing and stick to it. You're choice. the additional chakra you use is not normal chakra, it's special extra chakra and if you want it to be considered just as good as normal chakra point for point, you'll need less of it, as told above. Also, additional chakra is used to add or pump a jutsu within its limitations or add an additional effect, not to push it beyond its boundaries.
  
  
• you need to word this technique a tad better, you need speeds on how fast you can move the jutsu, and a clearer means on how you corrupt it. whether it be it coming into contact with an aura around you or you having to intercept it with your own chakra, in which case, you will need width and speeds of the lash of chakra you use to attempt control.
  
  
• If you're making this a variant of kai specific to this clan, you need to make it sufficiently different.
  

Will be working on history. It shall reach 1k as you ask! It may take a small bit, but I'll get there.

You're lowering the numbers for how much you can store. To the lines of 20 at D rank, and you can get another 20 per rank. So, 20, 40, 60, 80, 100 and 120 for SS rank.

Can you explain the choice of numbers? I'm all for changing it if your reasoning is sound.

Any elements of any technique you absorb lose all their properties as jutsu. If you indeed corrupt them with the darkness of negative emotion to the point that it would corrupt nature chakra, then elemental chakra would lose their identity. You're sucking in the chakra as a power-source, it would not retain any properties whils stored in a chakra pool within your body.

But what about what happened in canon, where Hiruko was able to steal elements as he pleased? He specifically mentioned that as an ability of his Meiton. I can try and change around my wording to accommodate this if you'd like. I admittedly took the creative liberty with corrupting chakra with negative emotions of the person I stole it from, so that I could give a reason that it couldn't be used like regular chakra, in an attempt to make it more balanced than just taking chakra and using it as normal. If there's another way to explain it so that the elements would stay,

You are not able to use 'ANY' possession style jutsu that would allow you to control or manipulate another player character directly. Jutsu which facilitate god-modding like shadow possession and the like are strictly not allowed. So, that rules controlling chakra within another person almost completely out, unless you're just doing things like 'drain touch.' But any ability which would force a person to roleplay their character under your control, is strictly a no-go.

This was not my intention, and I didn't think I needed to clarify this when it is very clearly against the rules. I can control chakra:

onstruct outside of the body, within another person, but only for the 'drain touch' you mentioned or on jutsu acting inside their body (such healing jutsu), or even armor-type jutsu. For those, I have stated in the Divine Possession jutsu that one can only halt the movement of these techniques where control would be GMing a person's character.

You need WAY more active disadvantages. #1

I want a 'bad' disadvantage for absorbing more than your limit. Something that can potentially be crippling.

And that detection clause, I want you to be 'unable' to hide it with stealth techniques.

How many is WAY more? Also, what am I trying to balance here, so I can create relevant drawbacks? I'd hate to just put 'this is here because it is'.

Easily done! A good thought to add that. Ba-boom! Your chakra pool explodes and so do your innards. Thank you for an active drawback idea, I admittedly am having a little trouble thinking up anything relevant at this point.

I had intended it to be pretty much unable to be circumvented, and shall clarify~

no elements, you say you remove special properties, elements are a very special property. You're deconstructing the jutsu and corrupting it and turning it into dark chakra, which, as you say, has no elemental affinity, strengths or weaknesses. Also, I'm not allowing you to both have a drain release like this, and also the ability to use chakra natures you don't have. Just no. Because if you don't have katon, you can't mould or control katon chakra. Simple as that.

Why are we straying from the canon ability of this advanced nature to temporarily steal elemental chakra natures? The entire reason they're able to use chakra natures they don't have the ability to mould themselves is because they can store others' chakra. If you'd like me to reword it differently, I will try my best.

And simply for all jutsu, you are not able to exceed the damages and benefits of jutsu within their rank. Ranges we can talk about, speeds... maybe in extreme cases, damages don't exceed max. Fin. as far as I'm concerned this jutsu is WAY too versitile as it stands to be this powerful, and in its current incarnation, i would like the beginning numbers on 'everything' to drop to almost minimum, then you can use dark chakra to bring them back up. Or, you can focus the jutsu to do a more specific thing and stick to it. You're choice. the additional chakra you use is not normal chakra, it's special extra chakra and if you want it to be considered just as good as normal chakra point for point, you'll need less of it, as told above. Also, additional chakra is used to add or pump a jutsu within its limitations or add an additional effect, not to push it beyond its boundaries.

Emphasis mine. Did you mean more, and where above are you referring? (Apologies for not following along.)
I don't consider it as good as normal chakra, which is why this mechanic costs as much as the original jutsu once over again. It is only as versatile as the element I manage to absorb, the selection of which is very narrow considering the reductions to the secondary chakra pool that are happening. Along that same nerf line, need I drop all the numbers to minimum if I could only ever increase one at a D-rank chakra pool? Which, I'm guessing, D-rank would probably be the rank that this would cause the most trouble if powered-up to maximum.

you need to word this technique a tad better, you need speeds on how fast you can move the jutsu, and a clearer means on how you corrupt it. whether it be it coming into contact with an aura around you or you having to intercept it with your own chakra, in which case, you will need width and speeds of the lash of chakra you use to attempt control.

When you say "the jutsu" in your first sentence, do you mean this technique, or the one I control? I do specifically state the latter moves at its normal speed, whatever it might be. I have changed this technique to a pulse-type (with a speed of its own) that emanates from the user, and added a blind spot for this pulse.

If you're making this a variant of kai specific to this clan, you need to make it sufficiently different.

Even though clans are allowed to copy-paste library jutsu and use them as clan jutsu? I'll change the mechanic, but I'm not sure how much I can change from the original writeup's abilities without it being labeled overpowered or whatever else.

I....hope I got everything.

Will be working on history. It shall reach 1k as you ask! It may take a small bit, but I'll get there.

Cool.

Can you explain the choice of numbers? I'm all for changing it if your reasoning is sound.

The aim is balance, with your numbers, the chakra imbalance would allow you to have a massive advantage against any opponent. You could absorb enough chakra to be equivalent to, or over, half of your opponents total reserve and use it against them. Which is frankly insane, considering it is renewable. My numbers allow you, per rank, to absorb jutsu at a time as normal, but allow the limit to be overwhelmed by your opponents unless you spend it quickly. I think of it like the necromancy advantage in fantasy. If you are able to raise the dead on a battlefield, every troop that dies is one of yours. With equal armies, your defeat is almost impossible, so, it needs to be bought down. This way, you could absorb 2 D rank jutsu at genin, or a C rank, which would be perfectly fine.

But what about what happened in canon, where Hiruko was able to steal elements as he pleased? He specifically mentioned that as an ability of his Meiton. I can try and change around my wording to accommodate this if you'd like. I admittedly took the creative liberty with corrupting chakra with negative emotions of the person I stole it from, so that I could give a reason that it couldn't be used like regular chakra, in an attempt to make it more balanced than just taking chakra and using it as normal. If there's another way to explain it so that the elements would stay,

Yeah, but the characters using this skill aren't Hiruko, who was an exceedingly powerful individual. Note that the uchiha also can't use amaterasu to burn down villages and manipulate time, space and causality with their eyes. So... let me put it to you this way, how about you change your kkg thing to have one of two effects, you can either break down a jutsu to add to your pool as dark chakra, or, you can catch it, and explode it back as a raw blast of its element in a cone? If you break it down into dark chakra, it would no longer have its elemental affinity. With something as potent as dark chakra already and having a sub chakra bar from taking techniques, you don't need to be able to use every element. You don't want every ninja of this clan being site plot villain tier in power.

This was not my intention, and I didn't think I needed to clarify this when it is very clearly against the rules. I can control chakra:

You have to be careful with your wording, and you have to express both a kkg's abilities AND limitations in the KKG section, you worded it to suggest you could control people's chakra while it was still within their bodies. That amount of control could EASILY imply you could control the person, and we cant have clans seeming to oppose rules like that. It's enabling.

Easily done! A good thought to add that. Ba-boom! Your chakra pool explodes and so do your innards. Thank you for an active drawback idea, I admittedly am having a little trouble thinking up anything relevant at this point.

I had intended it to be pretty much unable to be circumvented, and shall clarify~

Why are we straying from the canon ability of this advanced nature to temporarily steal elemental chakra natures? The entire reason they're able to use chakra natures they don't have the ability to mould themselves is because they can store others' chakra. If you'd like me to reword it differently, I will try my best.

See point above, but to go a little deeper, having a supplementary, re-filling chakra bar specifically for you, but also being able to steal other people's releases, especially things like advanced releases like ice and the like is a tad much. I don't know if you're forgetting, but Hiroku had use of: Wind, Lightning, Earth, Water, Dark, Steel, Storm AND Swift release in that movie... It was insane. So, how about i give you this bone, and this is 'as far' as im willing to go with this:

You can use other elemental chakra affinities to enhance your abilities due to absorbed chakra, so, if you absorb katon chakra and enhance one of your techniques it can burn. But you can only have 'one' elemental chakra in your reserve at a time. you could not hold onto say, Fire 'and' earth chakra. You would have to completely expend your reserved fire chakra in order to take on the new doton chakra. Combine this with the ability to empty your pool with the expenditure idea i had before (ignoring having to make the choice) and i think you have a balanced means of using it. Just keep it to the basic 5, and we should be okay. Stay away from absorbing advanced natures.

Emphasis mine. Did you mean more, and where above are you referring? (Apologies for not following along.)
I don't consider it as good as normal chakra, which is why this mechanic costs as much as the original jutsu once over again. It is only as versatile as the element I manage to absorb, the selection of which is very narrow considering the reductions to the secondary chakra pool that are happening. Along that same nerf line, need I drop all the numbers to minimum if I could only ever increase one at a D-rank chakra pool? Which, I'm guessing, D-rank would probably be the rank that this would cause the most trouble if powered-up to maximum.

adjust as necessary, additional effects on jutsu could be reduced to 5 or 10 of our dark chakra, rather than 10-15 or more, just try to focus the techniques a tad more. And the problem was, it 'could' be used as real chakra. Other techniques have additional costs, creating an additional value for chakra on site would be more than problematic with jutsu mods and others. So it's better to streamline their net worth. So, you're now literally getting an additional chakra bar for absorbed stuff, and its worth is as if you spend an additional 5 or 10 chakra on your ability, which should give you good things. Just remember, if the jutsu can do ALOT, or is powerful in multiple areas, they're going to get pulled down. Give yourself room to grow with your pump ups, its better to start really weak, to give a jutsu credit, and through the use of your KKG and the additional cost, MAKE it really strong. But as it stands its just really strong, and gets ridiculous.

When you say "the jutsu" in your first sentence, do you mean this technique, or the one I control? I do specifically state the latter moves at its normal speed, whatever it might be. I have changed this technique to a pulse-type (with a speed of its own) that emanates from the user, and added a blind spot for this pulse.

I'll let fuukai handle this one, but yeah. Basically, the jutsu YOU use, needed a projectile speed in order to take control of their jutsu (for interception and the like, you might be too slow, for example.). Then there would be the separate (or same) speed of which you could project the jutsu under your control.

Even though clans are allowed to copy-paste library jutsu and use them as clan jutsu? I'll change the mechanic, but I'm not sure how much I can change from the original writeup's abilities without it being labeled overpowered or whatever else.

I'm not labeling it as overpowered, I want the technique to be unique to the clan kkg and to reflect that, you can say rather than flushing the genjutsu you suck it into yourself or something of the like, which would be like, reverse ki... You have to remember that this is not like other clans, this is a banned, canon AND advanced element clan. It's not subject to the normal quality requirements.

I....hope I got everything.

me too.

I'm not the core person modding this clan, it will be Fuukai, but i will drop in now and then.

The clan you have now is of good quality, don't get me wrong, it is simply our job to be hard on clans like this, and you probably picked... single handedly, the HARDEST clan possible to get approved. So, sorry if it seems like at any point we're being asses.

Considering that this clan:

• Has an advanced release: (instant us going hard on you)
  
• Is canon: (which requires a staff level of quality throughout. Including clan history)
  
• Is a banned release: (everything needs to be 150% balanced without any means or room for even percieved abuse)
  
• drains chakra: (also banned as a separate thing, so, you're double banned now.... wow.)
  
• Steals chakra natures... (triple banned... at this point, you're lucky its not denied on principle.)

I hope that helps explain our position a tad. :)

The clan you have now is of good quality, don't get me wrong, it is simply our job to be hard on clans like this, and you probably picked... single handedly, the HARDEST clan possible to get approved. So, sorry if it seems like at any point we're being asses.

Considering that this clan:

Has an advanced release: (instant us going hard on you)
Is canon: (which requires a staff level of quality throughout. Including clan history)
Is a banned release: (everything needs to be 150% balanced without any means or room for even percieved abuse)
drains chakra: (also banned as a separate thing, so, you're double banned now.... wow.)
Steals chakra natures... (triple banned... at this point, you're lucky its not denied on principle.)

Ehehe, I knew that in the back of my mind to begin with, but....did it anyhow. Let's see if I can get through it all and have a triple unban under my belt. I didn't think chakra nature stealing was banned, though? Just KKG copying.

See point above, but to go a little deeper, having a supplementary, re-filling chakra bar specifically for you, but also being able to steal other people's releases, especially things like advanced releases like ice and the like is a tad much. I don't know if you're forgetting, but Hiroku had use of: Wind, Lightning, Earth, Water, Dark, Steel, Storm AND Swift release in that movie... It was insane. So, how about i give you this bone, and this is 'as far' as im willing to go with this:

You can use other elemental chakra affinities to enhance your abilities due to absorbed chakra, so, if you absorb katon chakra and enhance one of your techniques it can burn. But you can only have 'one' elemental chakra in your reserve at a time. you could not hold onto say, Fire 'and' earth chakra. You would have to completely expend your reserved fire chakra in order to take on the new doton chakra. Combine this with the ability to empty your pool with the expenditure idea i had before (ignoring having to make the choice) and i think you have a balanced means of using it. Just keep it to the basic 5, and we should be okay. Stay away from absorbing advanced natures.

Hiruko had the use of Dark, Steel, Storm, and Swift Releases due to his Chimera technique, not because he used Dark Release to steal them. However, I had from the start stated in the Inhaling Maw technique that while I could absorb advanced release jutsu, I couldn't get anything out of them aside from one of their base natures.

You have to be careful with your wording, and you have to express both a kkg's abilities AND limitations in the KKG section, you worded it to suggest you could control people's chakra while it was still within their bodies. That amount of control could EASILY imply you could control the person, and we cant have clans seeming to oppose rules like that. It's enabling.

Understood, changed.~



Judgement: Reduced damage and range, as well as adjusted the Dark Chakra costs.

I'll let fuukai handle this one, but yeah. Basically, the jutsu YOU use, needed a projectile speed in order to take control of their jutsu (for interception and the like, you might be too slow, for example.). Then there would be the separate (or same) speed of which you could project the jutsu under your control.

The pulse of my own jutsu now has a speed, so it could be too slow. The speed of the technique that I take control of (which is proportional to how much chakra I spend) would stay the same as its writeup lists.


Kai: Changed the mechanic to absorbing the jutsu into the secondary chakra pool by exerting their internal chakra flow towards it. The initial chakra expenditure is because they can't stop themselves from eating their own chakra up when their chakra flow is messed with.~

Drawbacks:

Add in that all elemental dark chakra that is absorbed must be used up before dark chakra of a different element can be stored. As it was asked by Aya.


Jutsu:

Judgement

Bring the numbers down on this jutsu as you were asked by Aya. You won't be exceeding any of the guideline restrictions with this jutsu so original stats + evolution buffs are less than or equal to guideline rules. Note that I will be asking you to adjust these further once I see your changes.

for the katon version, specify that only flammable things are set on fire, like some clothing, and that the fire is natural.

"Doton: [...] Targets are then trapped under the rubble..."
How does this happen exactly?

Gonna have to say no to the stat reduction for suiton, too stronk.

Remove the additional effects. It is simply too much for an already jam packed jutsu, especially for C rank. Simplicity is the best policy and stripping away what you can in this intensely detailed clan is neccesary.

Divine possession

Your jutsu name and spoiler description arent the same

" however, any damaging potential and speed the controlled jutsu has is retained"
this is fine, but I want the speed at which you control it to have an upper limit of 20 m/s.

"cannot be controlled to manipulate a person's movement, but they can be forced to stop or act in other ways"
This is very shaky ground, would like a lot more here on what this means or for you to remove it completely.

What level of strength is required for someone to hold onto a chakra construct and resist the users control?

Fukai wrote:Drawbacks:

Add in that all elemental dark chakra that is absorbed must be used up before dark chakra of a different element can be stored. As it was asked by Aya.

I would ask why it has to be this way. There was no explanation given as to the why, which is the premise on which other parts of this clan have been changed; I'm not keen on mindless changes when sound reasoning has been given for other parts. Suppose that I'm spoiled in a way because of that. However, I present an alternative, where a new absorbed nature "erases" the old one, and all chakra of the previous nature turns non-elemental.

Judgement

Bring the numbers down on this jutsu as you were asked by Aya. You won't be exceeding any of the guideline restrictions with this jutsu so original stats + evolution buffs are less than or equal to guideline rules. Note that I will be asking you to adjust these further once I see your changes.

I have reduced the lateral range to 25m (max D-rank, minimum C-rank), the maximum diameter of the cone at farthest point to 7m (below the 4m radius->8m diameter of D-rank maximum/C-rank minimum), and the damage to widespread minor bruising (D-rank damage). I have minimized the range and damage, and the speed is mid-rank for C at 20m/s. I have removed the base Dark Chakra cost for this jutsu, as the jutsu's base power no longer seems to deserve it. Instead, elemental effects have been relocated to the Infinite Evolution portion of the jutsu I have removed enhancing elemental effects in the spoiler as well, as you asked.

for the katon version, specify that only flammable things are set on fire, like some clothing, and that the fire is natural.

Very reasonable, I have changed it to how you asked.

"Doton: [...] Targets are then trapped under the rubble..."
How does this happen exactly?

Detailed.

Gonna have to say no to the stat reduction for suiton, too stronk.

A -1 according to the stat rules only really matters after 3 posts, but whatever....I've changed it so it makes all contacted surfaces slippery, requiring Supernatural Walking Practice to not drop anything or slip.

Divine possession

Your jutsu name and spoiler description arent the same

I'm quite aware. I follow the pattern of the spoiler having a more anglicized name while the jutsu name is a direct translation (such as Inhaling Maw having the English translation of Black Hole).

" however, any damaging potential and speed the controlled jutsu has is retained"
this is fine, but I want the speed at which you control it to have an upper limit of 20 m/s.

Why? I really don't think asking for solid logic and reason behind what you're telling me to change is all that unreasonable. If you are thinking that perhaps resistance from the original caster slows the jutsu down, I can understand that is a very real possibility. However, what about a static decrease (5/10 m/s) instead of decreasing it to a set speed?

"cannot be controlled to manipulate a person's movement, but they can be forced to stop or act in other ways"
This is very shaky ground, would like a lot more here on what this means or for you to remove it completely.

Hopefully clarified.

What level of strength is required for someone to hold onto a chakra construct and resist the users control?

Strength as in....? Physical strength, jutsu strength? An exertion of chakra into the jutsu to override control? I'm afraid I have no clue which, if any, of the above you're asking me to implement.

However, I present an alternative, where a new absorbed nature "erases" the old one, and all chakra of the previous nature turns non-elemental.

So since this is aya's change, I cannot speak for him as for his reasoning. However I agree with him on this as erasing elemental chakra from your pool would require some control over that element. I don't really have any big concerns with your change although I will say that you've made the elemental side of it slightly stronger so that will be taken into consideration for balance.

KKG:

"Absorbing jutsu is similar to a defensive technique, but it can only absorb 1 jutsu of equal rank or 1 rank higher, or 2 jutsu of 1 rank lower. It can absorb the base chakra cost of a technique."
remove the one rank higher, as this is too strong of an extra effect of the jutsu.

Drawbacks:

Even though you have a long list of drawbacks, not many of them are active drawbacks. I would like 3 more active drawbacks. These are things that take affect in battle and cannot be trained out of.

Jutsu:

Inhaling maw

"As they use this technique, a Meiton user can gauge how much chakra is in a technique, and can pay multiples of 10 chakra to increase the rank of this jutsu appropriately."
I would like this removed as it sounds like you want to be defending against high rank jutsu with a low ranked jutsu.

Wicked Self-Destruction Extraction

Again, this jutsu cannot go beyond the guidelines. So if you want 20 m/s, remove the evolution of buffing it's speed. Also add in that the cap for the evolution are the guidelines.

"Targets that cannot get away from the rain of debris are then trapped under the rubble"
give the height that the debris can get to.

Dark Release, Divine Possession

upper limit of 25m/s speed because that is the guidelines value.

level of strenght as in the strength stat.

"It takes Strength of tier-3 of the controlled jutsu's rank to force it to move against the Meiton user's control"
I would like this put down to a flat value of C-3 as the strength of the jutsu should scale with it's rank.

On KKG, stated that Infinite Evolution needs at least 10 elemental chakra to add it to a technique (that is able to take on elemental affinity).

Fukai wrote:
So since this is aya's change, I cannot speak for him as for his reasoning. However I agree with him on this as erasing elemental chakra from your pool would require some control over that element. I don't really have any big concerns with your change although I will say that you've made the elemental side of it slightly stronger so that will be taken into consideration for balance.

I didn't say that it was due to any control that they were able to overwrite chakra natures. It's actually due to a lack of chakra nature control that they cannot make multiple elements coexist in their chakra pool. The only reason they can have two is because there is more capacity for the elemental chakras to flow and not have to interact with each other.

"Absorbing jutsu is similar to a defensive technique, but it can only absorb 1 jutsu of equal rank or 1 rank higher, or 2 jutsu of 1 rank lower. It can absorb the base chakra cost of a technique."
remove the one rank higher, as this is too strong of an extra effect of the jutsu.

Done. I've also reduced the chakra gleaned from a technique absorbed this way (-5)

Even though you have a long list of drawbacks, not many of them are active drawbacks. I would like 3 more active drawbacks. These are things that take affect in battle and cannot be trained out of.

Added +1 damage from all opposing Ninjutsu, I'll try to think of more. Does not having access to Senjutsu count as a drawback? Since I know for pretty much any other specialization it really wouldn't pass, due to the clan not usually needing the restricted specs anyhow. Does Senjutsu, as an overall-boost type of specialization, stand out from the rest? (If it does not, I will remove it, as this clan has plenty of drawbacks as-is.)

If I am able to ask, can you list out what on the negatives exactly balances what on the positives? It would be easier for me to create drawbacks for the clan if I knew what exactly needed balancing, so I could come up with a relevant drawback for that specific part of the KKG.

Inhaling maw

"As they use this technique, a Meiton user can gauge how much chakra is in a technique, and can pay multiples of 10 chakra to increase the rank of this jutsu appropriately."
I would like this removed as it sounds like you want to be defending against high rank jutsu with a low ranked jutsu.

I've detailed that they can only use the normal ranks of the jutsu that they would normally be able to; rather, they can tell if they misjudged in using the wrong level of absorption and change its rank within their own means as an emergency backup. I didn't intend it to be able to go higher than one could normally do; sorry if it did seem like it.

Wicked Self-Destruction Extraction

Again, this jutsu cannot go beyond the guidelines. So if you want 20 m/s, remove the evolution of buffing it's speed. Also add in that the cap for the evolution are the guidelines.

I've bumped it down to 15m/s.


I'm just wondering....why is it that even though I spend chakra to get Dark Chakra to spend on techniques, I'm not allowed to make them more effective even in one area than other jutsu of "equal rank", given that they start mediocre?

I implore you, please don't respond with "because it's in the Guidelines", as the below quote in the Jutsu Guidelines states otherwise.

Increasing the chakra cost of, or giving drawbacks to, a jutsu can make it more powerful than the given rank by usually around one rank. However, doing so often makes it less effective in the long run than a technique of similar power that actually has the correct rank.

I'm having the technique's base power, speed, and range start at or below minimum C-rank ability, and having to pay chakra to bring it up to mid-power for its rank; so why am I unable to exceed the guideline's stated damage/numbers by paying even more Dark Chakra that I have to spend regular chakra to get anyhow?

---

"Targets that cannot get away from the rain of debris are then trapped under the rubble"
give the height that the debris can get to.

Done! It's equal to the maximum height of the base jutsu (7m if unaugmented). This is, of course, how high it's launched, not how much I pile up.

Dark Release, Divine Possession

upper limit of 25m/s speed because that is the guidelines value.

If I'm using the speed of a jutsu I took control of, shouldn't the speed of the controlled technique already be balanced within the Jutsu Guidelines' values anyhow? I'm not using my own speed because each technique's speed is different, and my jutsu doesn't move the controlled jutsu physically, it only assumes dominion over its 'master controls'. Due to the latter reason, this jutsu cannot control a jutsu beyond the functions the caster knows it can execute (i.e. has demonstrated thus far). However, in the case of moving a normally uncontrolled projectile, a set speed does make perfect sense, and I shall change the jutsu to reflect this as such.

level of strength* as in the strength stat.

"It takes Strength of tier-3 of the controlled jutsu's rank to force it to move against the Meiton user's control"
I would like this put down to a flat value of C-3 as the strength of the jutsu should scale with it's rank.

As somewhat stated above, I'm not using my own jutsu's strength to restrain them, I'm using their jutsu's strength, because I took over their jutsu. This jutsu's chakra takes the master controls from the original jutsu caster, it doesn't require the Meiton user's own chakra to make parts of a jutsu move (or not-move, depending). I hope I'm not seeming too contrary on this particular jutsu, it's just the reasons you're giving me for why I need to change my jutsu aren't very applicable.

Drawbacks:

So the active drawbacks that are needed are mainly to counterbalance the chakra stealing part of the KKG. Being able to attack an opponents chakra pool directly is an ability that cannot be understated. The weakness to ninjutsu is a good start.

Being unable to take senjutsu won’t count as much of a drawback as it is completely avoided if you didn't want to take it in the first place.

Remove "At A-rank, the ninja's chakra pool is sufficiently large to accommodate two chakra natures rather than one." It has been made clear multiple times that you are only to be having one absorbed nature at a time.

Jutsu

Wicked Self-Destruction Extraction

As you are not going over the normal cost with your own chakra, that rule may not necessarily apply. You can make the jutsu cost 40 normal chakra if you like.

This next point I make is very important: Guidelines are just that, guidelines. They are upper limits that will be taken into consideration for balance. The values that they state however, are not things that are owed to every jutsu, balance must be sought so that jutsu will not be too strong even if they meet the guidelines. As Aya has said, we may be able to stretch the guideline values for you in some areas for your dark chakra enhancements, but for this particular jutsu, which is: area of effect, can cause distraction/impairment, is too strong to be allowed to go over. That is my final word on this case.

Take the range enhancement down to +10 single direction and +5 cone width.

Add in that the enhancements cannot go over the values listed in the guidelines.

Divine Possession

25m/s speed upper limit to avoid fringe cases where the enemy's projectile is above that. There could be any sort of combo or the like that could increase the speed of something.

I don’t care what the strength or ability of the jutsu you are controlling is, I am balancing YOUR jutsu, and I would like the strength level set as above.

Fukai wrote:Drawbacks:

So the active drawbacks that are needed are mainly to counterbalance the chakra stealing part of the KKG. Being able to attack an opponents chakra pool directly is an ability that cannot be understated. The weakness to ninjutsu is a good start.

I've added a -25 to chakra pool.

http://www.narutosaga.com/t10868-shiki-iga-clan

Two of my drawbacks now equate with the drawbacks of another clan that attacks the chakra pool directly; I actually modeled my direct-draining technique guidelines after theirs. Given that the Shiki-Iga have a lot less drawbacks (and some of them are most likely not even for the draining part, hopefully), I presume that it's more of the fact that I can actually use the drained chakra rather than the actual draining that is being balanced at this point? Or it should be.

Remove "At A-rank, the ninja's chakra pool is sufficiently large to accommodate two chakra natures rather than one." It has been made clear multiple times that you are only to be having one absorbed nature at a time.

But no one ever gave me a good reason why. It was just kind of 'this is the way you need to do it, because I said so'.

Ayakashi wrote:You can use other elemental chakra affinities to enhance your abilities due to absorbed chakra, so, if you absorb katon chakra and enhance one of your techniques it can burn. But you can only have 'one' elemental chakra in your reserve at a time. you could not hold onto say, Fire 'and' earth chakra. You would have to completely expend your reserved fire chakra in order to take on the new doton chakra. Combine this with the ability to empty your pool with the expenditure idea i had before (ignoring having to make the choice) and i think you have a balanced means of using it. Just keep it to the basic 5, and we should be okay. Stay away from absorbing advanced natures.

If a well-thought-out reason could be provided , I'd be happy to go along with any number of items I am asked to change. I know a lot of things that are asked are in the spirit of balance, but I truly have difficulty accepting things without having a reason why something has to be. Changes should make sense in as many ways as possible. I don't think that's much to ask of my superiors on the site; if you hold me to a high standard with this app, so too do I hold you all to a higher standard in modding it.

Wicked Self-Destruction Extraction

As you are not going over the normal cost with your own chakra, that rule may not necessarily apply. You can make the jutsu cost 40 normal chakra if you like.

Ayakashi wrote:
adjust as necessary, additional effects on jutsu could be reduced to 5 or 10 of (y)our dark chakra, rather than 10-15 or more, just try to focus the techniques a tad more. And the problem was, it 'could' be used as real chakra. Other techniques have additional costs, creating an additional value for chakra on site would be more than problematic with jutsu mods and others. So it's better to streamline their net worth. So, you're now literally getting an additional chakra bar for absorbed stuff, and its worth is as if you spend an additional 5 or 10 chakra on your ability, which should give you good things. Just remember, if the jutsu can do ALOT, or is powerful in multiple areas, they're going to get pulled down. Give yourself room to grow with your pump ups, its better to start really weak, to give a jutsu credit, and through the use of your KKG and the additional cost, MAKE it really strong. But as it stands its just really strong, and gets ridiculous.

Emphases mine. I'm just wondering how what you say plays out when Aya kind of stated that it pretty much equates to the mechanic I mentioned in my above post, if I'm reading what was said correctly. I should also note that the italicized portion has been addressed, as Judgement has been and continues to be pulled down, no?

This next point I make is very important: Guidelines are just that, guidelines. They are upper limits that will be taken into consideration for balance. The values that they state however, are not things that are owed to every jutsu, balance must be sought so that jutsu will not be too strong even if they meet the guidelines. As Aya has said, we may be able to stretch the guideline values for you in some areas for your dark chakra enhancements, but for this particular jutsu, which is: area of effect, can cause distraction/impairment, is too strong to be allowed to go over. That is my final word on this case.

It was actually not my original plan to want to exceed guidelines with Infinite Evolution. It was purely the reductions in all capabilities to or below minimum C-rank standard. You seem to be ignoring yet again the fact that I spend chakra to take chakra for use in powering up techniques; it is not a resource I can create ad infinitum.

Take the range enhancement down to +10 single direction and +5 cone width. Done~ I've also reduced base cone width to 4m max diameter at the max 25m lateral range (so it is smaller before that). This makes it slightly larger than Katon: Endan at max range, but smaller below that; its lateral range is also below that of the technique I referenced. (Great Fireball has a lateral range of 40m and a projectile width of 5m, as another reference if you need it.)

Add in that the enhancements cannot go over the values listed in the guidelines. Debating, at least on speed/range. This particular technique can do fine with only one damage enhancement.

25m/s speed upper limit to avoid fringe cases where the enemy's projectile is above that. There could be any sort of combo or the like that could increase the speed of something.

I can put in that modifications to jutsu speed, and even overall power (like an A-rank jutsu's full +1), are annulled if I take control. Would that make for a sufficient avoidance of fringe cases?

I don’t care what the strength or ability of the jutsu you are controlling is, I am balancing YOUR jutsu, and I would like the strength level set as above.

That's not a valid counterpoint to my argument. Please tell me why, given how the jutsu works, it would become stronger/weaker. You may not care, but I do.

Drawbacks:

Only one elemental nature to be stored at one time. Housing two seperate elements and then drawing on them independently of each other to manipulate them into any range of jutsu that you want is too much.

" taking 1 rank higher in damage from opponents' attacks that primarily use Ninjutsu as their offense"
Can you clear this up by simply saying 'taking 1 rank higher in damage from ninjutsu' or is there some distinction that should be made clearer?

Jutsu:

Wicked Self-Destruction Extraction

"Range: Cone that reaches out to 205, up to 4m diameter at farthest point (2m diameter at 10m)"
I think theres a typo in there for your range

State that this jutsu cannot go over the values listed in the guidelines.

Divine Possession

25m/s speed upper limit and a flat value of C-3 to break out of the bind as the strength of the jutsu should be reflective of it's rank


This clan will not be modded again until all of these changes have been made. You are more than welcome to contact an admin if you wish to challenge something here.

" taking 1 rank higher in damage from opponents' attacks that primarily use Ninjutsu as their offense"
Can you clear this up by simply saying 'taking 1 rank higher in damage from ninjutsu' or is there some distinction that should be made clearer?

I guess just covering the angle of multi-specialization jutsu that might use Ninjutsu for something other than actually attacking, and another spec for true offense. If offensive jutsu that only use Ninjutsu for the non-attacking part don't actually count as "ninjutsu attacks", I can easily change it.~

I fixed that typo, thank you for noticing that, ehehehe. 205 range....silly me.

Other than that, I'll be contacting an admin....since no real explanations are being given and no discussion is being had.

---

To Admins:

There are a few things that are getting nowhere with discussion, which is why I had to call yourselves in.

-Infinite Evolution was ruled to be unable to go above the listed maximums in Jutsu Guidelines. I argue that because I need to use chakra to get Dark Chakra to spend on Infinite Evolution, it should be allowed to.

-It was ruled that those with a secondary chakra pool are unable to absorb another elemental nature until the first is completely gone from their chakra pool, and that they cannot contain two absorbed natures at once at higher ranks. This was well-intentioned in making it so that I cannot use every element at once, but even without these mechanics I would still have to rely on other people firing multiple elemental jutsu at me at once; in other words, it is entirely dependent on other ninja using elements. I have in retrospect added a clause saying that directly stealing chakra from people cannot give me an elemental nature to use.

-The last thing, I think, was about Dark Release: Angelic Assertion. The mod states that even though it takes over the physical manifestation of a jutsu, my technique would change its speed and potentially its physical constitution simply by taking rein of its master controls. I suppose I just don't see his reasoning in "I'm modding YOUR jutsu".

Thank you for your time in looking at this! I do appreciate it a lot!

I will be taking the modding of this app from this point forward.

Now, before I begin. I will begin by saying that I will not petition ownership to redact Dark Release from the banned list unless any change I request is made. There will be no appealing or negotiation.

So from a quick scan, here is what I noticed needs to be changed before we can continue any further.

Dark release is not its own element. It is merely the discipline. Specifically the jutsu used to absorb and counterfire a jutsu through the palms. Users will not be able to manipulate or expel "dark chakra". Something like that would have to be a different clan entirely. Dark release is not going to be a chakra nature in the same way that fire, water, lightning, earth, or wind are.

You can't manipulate another person's chakra without taking possession of it through the technique.

It cannot absorb Senjutsu with impunity. Without being able to manipulate senjutsu yourself, senjutsu would cause damage to the arm that absorbs it, at the very least.

Absorption must be done through the mark, which I want on the palms.

Absorption or refiring costs the equal amount of chakra of the original jutsu. i.e. Absorbing a B-Rank jutsu (20 chakra) would cost you 20 chakra to absorb. and then 20 chakra to re-fire. You aren't getting a perfect defense and a dedicated attack in one at a discount.

No chakra draining. Period.

Dark release is not its own element. It is merely the discipline. Specifically the jutsu used to absorb and counterfire a jutsu through the palms. Users will not be able to manipulate or expel "dark chakra". Something like that would have to be a different clan entirely. Dark release is not going to be a chakra nature in the same way that fire, water, lightning, earth, or wind are.

You can't manipulate another person's chakra without taking possession of it through the technique.

It cannot absorb Senjutsu with impunity. Without being able to manipulate senjutsu yourself, senjutsu would cause damage to the arm that absorbs it, at the very least.

Absorption must be done through the mark, which I want on the palms.

All fixed, I think.

Absorption or refiring costs the equal amount of chakra of the original jutsu. i.e. Absorbing a B-Rank jutsu (20 chakra) would cost you 20 chakra to absorb. and then 20 chakra to re-fire. You aren't getting a perfect defense and a dedicated attack in one at a discount.

No chakra draining. Period.

Can I ask why? This is really just so I know where you're coming from, not to challenge the position or anything. I'll either go with it or just delete the clan, since this was mostly to see what I could get unbanned. Without those two, it's really just a rehash of what other clans, and even just Sealing in general, can already do.

The absorption on its own is a nearly perfect defense against ninjutsu, not unlike the Rinnegan's absorption seal, distinctively more powerful than any barrier ninjutsu because it negates the jutsu entirely, not simply upfront damage, but any auxiliary effects as well. The absorption itself is a defensive jutsu. On top of that, the Judgment technique is a separate jutsu from inhaling maw (its parent jutsu) to begin with. Dark release doesn't act as a conductor to redirect techniques. It absorbs and dismantles an incoming jutsu entirely. After a technique is absorbed, then judgment is used. Two separate jutsu, two separate costs. There are probably ways to alter judgment to be more unique given Inhaling maw's interaction with an incoming jutsu, but a free perfect defense + dedicated attack is not one that I can allow. I would be more inclined to approve something like Judgment's elemental affinity being determined by the nature of the jutsu that Inhaling maw absorbed.

As far as chakra draining goes. The mechanic of replenishing one's own chakra by draining another's is because chakra is the only IC resource that characters have to manage. Having more chakra available to you at any given time is an enourmous advantage, simply because a person can turn a fight into a war of attrition and the person with less will eventually lose by default.

I earnestly thank you for taking the time to write that out.... it means a lot having someone thoroughly explain what they think. After thoroughly reading through your thoughts expressed here, I'm very inclined to try and make this work.

Although I tried to make chakra absorption into Dark Chakra to be less useful than directly, I can see the spirit of the concern, so I'll drop that bit. At least some facet of what was originally there remains; that being the change in elemental nature of techniques such as Judgement due to the chakra nature of a jutsu that's been absorbed by techniques like Inhaling Maw.

So, would that make both Inhaling Maw and Judgement multi-rank jutsu, or simply variable-cost? I admit I'm holding off on tweaking things until I know how I should implement this.